Through evolution we have been programmed to associate music with security of the group being nearby. Now we can listen to music even though the group is very distant in time and space. Maybe it's not a complete reality mismatch because in a sense we are still close to the group through the Internet.
However the positive feelings are over exaggerated given the limited modern benefits.
That’s a fascinating take. Music until very recently was indeed an incredibly social activity bound with layers of talent, leisure (purpose/meaning/security), belonging, etc.
As people have been chatting about the Metaverse or AR I often quip that we’ve already had AR for awhile: headphones.
The ubiquitous of AirPods, even amongst employees on the clock in recent years, has only reinforced my belief that we are already deep down the AR rabbit hole and seeing both the positive and negative effects. Augmented reality is great, but we still need to be grounded and able to act within reality. It’s the reality that must be our base, not the augmented part. The augmented should serve to improve reality, not replace.
One of the most enjoyable musical experiences I had recently was on a choir exchange in Europe. We were at a concert afterparty with choirs from two other countries, exchanging drunken folk songs. Were we pleasant to listen to? Probably not. It was raucous and out of tune, but it was a bunch of people sharing something we loved.
Singing in adult choirs has been one of my most spiritually and socially rewarding activities. You really feel a brother in arms with your fellow singers. Perhaps it is because singing is such an embarrassing activity in isolation, but then the sheer force of all the voices come together to make something of such power and beauty that you are incapable of replicating yourself. I’ll never forget the tenors I sang Faures Requiem or Beethoven 9th with.
i had a similar experience in scouting. german scouting has a strong singing tradition to the point that there are regular competitions that attract groups from all over europe. also camps where multiple groups meet. imagine your after party experience every night for multiple days, maybe even a week or two.
We created office jobs that required sustained individual focus.
The traditional (high-walled) cube farm may be ugly, but it's also one where an employee could often work at their desk with relatively few distractions. If you're not going to build private offices, they're not that awful of a compromise for enabling focus.
Then in the past decade or two, we had the open-office trend, and changed the office to one full of endless visual and auditory distractions making focus difficult.
Employees wearing headphones at work is an obvious attempt by many to reduce the distractions that bad office design has created.
To be honest, I dont have a lot of time for complaints from such people. Maybe I am one, but the solution is to go live in a cabin and bake your own bread, not sit at the table looking for sympathy.
That wasn't my reading. It was the bread or death part that did for me.
To me it seemed like melodramatic self pity, like the person complain that they had no other choice but go to the party but be alone. If someone hates company, they should go be a hermit, not show up and tell everyone about it.
It's okay to be a loner or a hermit. If you're not doing it, then either you are choosing the trade offs or you don't actually want it.
People should own their choices. Self pity and denial of agency are two of the most self destructive cognitive phenomenon.
Sure seemed melodramatic to me. care to explain the choice between bread and an empty belly in a way that isn't intended to garner sympathy? It is a pretty loaded metaphor.
the problem is in your apparent conclusion that "people without a tribe" are only in that state because they hate company. which doesn't make sense. if they indeed hated company they would not do what you say is bothering you. the reason they come to the party alone and tell you about it is because they do want company but have difficulty finding that company. being a loner most often is not a choice. it is something that we force onto others because we don't accept them the way they are. those who are loners by choice are not the kind of people who go to parties.
what agency is it that i should have that would allow me to make friends with people? i can't use my agency to change the behavior of others. you are right of course that self pity and denial of agency don't help. but the comments you are responding to don't talk about that at all. they are not suggesting that people without a tribe wallow in self pity and denial of agency. you brought that up.
i am the kind of person that has difficulty finding a tribe. (my tribe is here on HN and in the FOSS community to an extent. but those people are all distant and hard to meet. btw, you are one of the few names on HN that i recognize because of interesting discussions we had already). except i don't show up at parties where i am not welcome and don't talk to people that don't want to listen to me. but that's why i used my agency to leave my home country and travel the world to find communities that accept others without judging them and without expecting them to change just for the sake of being accepted.
My rant was specifically about people who embed themselves in a group, but resent the group and their situation. Thats how I interpreted "[Their] choice is not between bread and cake, but between bread and an empty belly."
If this is not the case, then the rant doesn't apply.
The the fine article is about listening to music alone fostering a sense of well being.
The comment to which I responded was about how degraded that experience is relative to music in social settings.
When a person does not have access to those social settings they are not better for that person…and as your comments suggest, often worse than nothing. On the other hand headphones are better than nothing.
The bread and cake are an historical reference.
HN guidelines are to make the charitable readings of other people’s comments. They are linked at the bottom of the page.
There are a lot of things that I find wrong with Spotify, but one of the features it does have that I have found helpful is a feature where you can listen along using what Spotify calls a Jam:
> Friends who join a Jam can listen and add songs to the queue together, whether in-person or virtually.
> Note: Premium is needed to start and host a Jam. Free users can join and add songs to a Jam hosted by a Premium user, allowing for in-person Jams. This feature works also with smart speakers and most Bluetooth speakers.
I've used this with online friends, and it's really good. If you use a voice chat app (we usually use Mumble) you can even talk while the music plays.
i thought it is comparable to talking to my friends online instead of in person. in my case those friends are on a different continent. i do have local fiends too, but talking to my online friends is what keeps me connected to my the place where i grew up. (even though these friends are not from that time)
interestingly, as someone who plays an instrument, i don't enjoy just listening to music as much because i'd rather play with friends
Through evolution we have been programmed to associate music with security of the group being nearby. Now we can listen to music even though the group is very distant in time and space. Maybe it's not a complete reality mismatch because in a sense we are still close to the group through the Internet.
However the positive feelings are over exaggerated given the limited modern benefits.