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For anyone else not familiar with "anti-BDS":

"Anti-BDS laws are legislation that retaliate against those that engage in Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions. With regard to the Arab–Israeli conflict, many supporters of the State of Israel have often advocated or implemented anti-BDS laws, which effectively seek to retaliate against people and organizations engaged in boycotts of Israel-affiliated entities."

From Wikipedia. Also: "Not to be confused with Anti-BDSM laws."





From a historical, economic, social perspective... Why does Israel hold so much power over the world?

Most of geopolitics is geography and Israel has greatly benefitted as a unique bridgehead in hostile territory for a changing roster of great-powers and states against another foe e.g.

- Early Soviet support to undermine British Imperialism

- Balfour Declaration from Britain vs. Ottomans

- Nuclear tech from France vs. Nasser and anti-colonialism

- Military/Nuclear from Apartheid South Africa vs. shared pariah status

- Hegemonic power from the US vs. every unaligned country including Cold War, OPEC, Arab Nationalism, Islamism

The more recent metastasising of support into a political-religous-racial belief-system is even more troubling than the apocalyptic machinations of great powers because pure ideology departs from reason itself and is untethered to any care for the consequences.


The theory I've been operating under is that Israel was created as a pretty bad solution to displaced Jews post-WWII, and operates essentially as a vassal state of the US's commercial military interests as a totally intractable perma-war in the region to ensure that even in lieu of other conflict taxpayer money can continuously be laundered to them in the form of expended munitions.

There's obviously a lot more going on from a social/religious perspective, but I'm prone to thinking of large-scale shifts and trends in terms of economic incentives.


I believe it's the other way around: The western governments, media and legislative bodies are under Israeli control.

Have you seen how the US Congress, half of which boos the US presidents along party lines, suddenly all rise up and fall in line when Netanyahu visits the Congress?

https://idsb.tmgrup.com.tr/ly/uploads/images/2024/07/28/thum...

Have you see the strange photos of all US politicians with yamakas near this wall in Israel as if they're pledging allegiance to something?

It's humiliating


It is humiliating, but that makes no sense at all from a power dynamics perspective. Israel is just not that powerful, economically, militarily, or socially. The US's military industrial complex is, and basically every politician is beholden to powerful capital interests, the MIC among them. Unconditional and enthusiastic support of Israel, then, is a proxy for support of those financial interests, hence the visits, deference, etc. This backed up by the very real threat of a handful of powerful lobbying groups that will and have coordinated to redirect funding to opponents of anyone they deem insufficiently deferential.

Recall please Grover Norquist. In the 90s and 2000s he leveraged proximity with the post-Reagan new conservative wave to grow a relatively modest org, Americans for Tax Reform, to a near universal policy chokehold on the Republican party.

Through a socially viral "no net new tax" promise, once Norquist secured pledges from party leaders, essentially all federal elected Republicans had to pledge as well. They were otherwise threatened with losing endorsement from Norquist and faced being ostracized and primaried. The leaders themselves were then caught in the net and none felt like they could break.

ATR influence has waned in the face of MAGA's more populist fiscal liberalism, but that was pretty much just one guy.

Extend that singular goal to a network with a narrow and aligned interest, and it can be very effectively maintained with intelligent and shifting messaging and reputation management. Consider how people like Loomer and Raichik that have emerged, not through established power brokers, but organically through social media platforms, and the significant influence they possess even in the White House.


Mossad is the missing link here.

They have power by being able to expose western leaders for any number of hypocrisies.


Or more likely outright blackmail. The curious handling of the Epstein scandal comes to mind.

A Tablet columnist recently wrote that suspecting a Jewish person of blackmailing is an anti-Semitic trope.

https://firstthings.com/the-epstein-myth/


Far too many conflate critique of Israel with critique of Judaism.

israel is #7 destination for weapons exports in usa with 3.6%

https://nordicdefencereview.com/u-s-tops-arms-trade-while-al...


I see we are going full conspiracy theories in this thread...

How can you say it’s a conspiracy theory when you see tons of verified news articles with all of these Western politicians so supplicant to Israel and Israeli politicians?

What’s surprising is that this not a bigger part of the conversation.


Perhaps they have an understanding of the history of the region that goes further back than 2022, to truly understand this conflict you have to go back a couple hundred years.

If you read history and understand that Jews are persecuted and murdered in every country that is not Israel, what are they supposed to do?

Should we blame the Ottoman Empire for not industrializing earlier and losing the technology race to Europe and collapsing? After all, if the Ottoman Empire hadn’t collapsed at the end of WW I, Palestine would likely still be a Muslim territory.

That’s how far back you have to go to find a good starting point to explain how the conflict got to the point it’s at now.


Every genocide has a justification that makes complete sense to the people carrying out or abetting the genocide.

> Israel is just not that powerful, economically, militarily, or socially.

Its not just funding and religious indoctrination. The very, very serious question that nobody seems to have the courage to ask, is this: where are Israels nukes?

The answer to that question might provide some insight into why things are so supplicant in certain halls of power ...


Are you fsuggesting Israel has a nuclear sub off the east coast or something? Why would nukes in Israel influence washington?

Israels nukes are man-portable.

Israel wasn't created from nothing post-WW2. It was already 50 years into building a jewish state in first the Ottoman Empire and then British Palestine. Holocaust refugees, although symbolically important, were never a large portion of Israel's immigrant population.

The UN declaration was recognition of reality on the ground. And was, btw, rejected by the Arab parties and doesn't carry the force of international law. Israel declared its independence irregardless of the resolution the following year.


How much land did Jews own then and how much did they have after 48?

Jerusalem was Jewish majority decades before the British mandate began.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographic_history_of_Jerus...


The answer is that jews owned around 6% of the land but got 56% in the partition.

And Arabs owned about 8% of the land. Still more than the Jews, but nowhere near the 94% implied by omission.

In any case, go look at the malaria maps and desert areas. Notice how they match up with the areas allocated to Jews. The Jews may have gotten allocated slightly more land, but it was not fertile or desirable land.


IIRC and AFAIK the plans for Israel were made by the precursors to UN way before Holocaust.

Holocaust was not the reason for the plan for a Jewish national home in historic Israel, Arab persecution of Jews in the region was.


  > Israel was created as a pretty bad solution to displaced Jews post-WWII
Though housing displaced Jews is undoubtedly a part of it, presenting that as the main or only reason for the existence of the state of Israel is quite disingenuous. Jerusalem had been Jewish majority for a century before the state of Israel was founded, decades before the British ever stepped foot in the Holy Land. Generally, when a state represents its inhabitants that is considered a proper functioning state.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographic_history_of_Jerus...


Another possible explanation: Israel is a leading spyware manufacturer (e.g. Pegasus). They are probably involved in 'sensitive' eavesdropping operations world-wide, and quite likely, have data that would scare the world's leaders to even think not supporting Israel.

Isn't that found out that the "alternative" Signal client US Government officials are unofficially using is "backing-up" messages to company's server (probably in Israel).

This is a huge leverage.


[flagged]


I get this point, but also we shouldn't confuse "the jews people" with the current government of israel.

I don't believe for a second that the common jews people want to influence other countries or do anythind "bad". But at the same time can believe that the current government of israel, that has some extremist parties inside, can try to influence foreign policy in many ways, potentially even extreme ways.


The United States has had this relationship with Israel for how long? Trying to tie the relationship to Epstein or throwing out random 'I'm just asking questions' isn't legitimate and is purely just a smear attempt. The USA and Israel have a long and historic relationship no need for conspiracy theories that vear really close to anti-semitic tropes. Funny how these baseless, historically disproven (did Epstein/Telegram go back in time and create the US/Israel relationship?) unserious smear attempts are 'legitimate' discussion when it comes to Israel, but not really any other discussion. This is no different than the disgusting BS pushing Israel somehow is responsible for Charlie Kirk.

“Never believe that antisemites are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies. They know their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. The antisemite has the right to play. They even like to play with discourse, for by giving ridiculous reasons they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutor. They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert.”


Ok I think we were talking about different things. I was referring to just the current conflict with gaza, without knowing any of the other things you just mentioned.

I'm not contraddicting anything you said, but at the same time I just want to point out that picking always "one side" without evaluating the facts each time is a dangerous position.

This population has been unfairly persecuted for a long time and it has been unfairly accused of many things, but this doesn't make what IDF is doing any more humane


It doesn’t. The US does, however, and the US has for decades put all of its weight behind Israel. Without that, Israel would probably have faced the same fate as apartheid South Africa.

The current genocide is to blame on the US as much as on Israel.


You're explaining what people can see. The question was why this happens though.

Why does this one country have such unwavering support? Why is the current president for example not trying to save some money by just not giving it to them?


> Why does Israel hold so much power over the world?

Because it holds so much power over the government of the United States, and thereby benefits from the power the United States has over the world.


Because protecting Israel is part of America's mythology.

Worth having a listen to Aaron Good, author of 'American Exception' being interviewed by Jeffrey Sachs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXvuOG33zLs

Some of the gist of what he talks about:

Just as there is an 'underworld', there is also a corresponding and related 'overworld'. Essentially organised crime, corporations, and security services cooperating in nefarious ways (often usurping - though not always violently - the power of states).

It's arguable that Israel is particularly interested and involved in this 'overworld'. See the early history of the CIA, FBI, Meyer Lansky and the mob, Epstein, the reach and effectiveness of Mossad relative to other similar organisations, etc.

Call me a conspiracy theorist if you like, but I believe that most significant western leaders have probably been compromised in some way by 'overworld' influences. Look at what happens to 'the wrong type of candidate' that gets too close to power. Jeremy Corban was thoroughly and dishonestly scandalised by a campaign instigated and supported by Israeli interests. Why? The complete bandwagon type behaviour of mainstream British press of the left and right in that campaign is very reminiscent of the way recent mainstream media coverage reports on Gaza - it looks coordinated and in unison.

Of course, I'm probably wrong. Just trying to make sense of the madness I see around me.

TLDR; My theory is that Israel has corrupted our media and politicians through a nexus of nefarious actors that Aaron Good refers to as the 'overworld'.


Is Israel able to cast this "overworld" power over China?

No. But interestingly Netanyahu just called out China as a state conspiring against Israel's interests. So rather than trying to corrupt China's political system in their favour the approach appears to be to frame them as an explicit enemy. I'm sure we'll start to hear more of this from Israel regarding China.

>Why does Israel hold so much power over the world?

Undeclared and un-identified nukes.


what power exactly Israel holds over the world ?

Threats of assassination, and other dirty intelligence operations to blackmail and coerce politicians. Lavish gifts, paid vacations and campaign assistance for any politician who plays ball. Nuclear threats. Religious influence.

none

Certainly holds significant influence over the US government.

Most of the US is pro israel. Therefore most of our government is pro israel. It is not complicated.

Arab nations have made invasions to Europe on a regular basis throughout history. That practically stopped when Israel was created.

Israel has been an amazing success for Western security.




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