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If it was a real problem, market pricing would reflect the increasing severity of that problem.

The truth is that people who care about port forwarding are such a small minority -- especially now that P2P file sharing has lost its hype -- that they don't make a visible dent in the rate of IPv4 exhaustion.




The truth is that major cloud providers such as Amazon AWS have begun to charge [more] for static, routed IPv4 addresses.

Last I checked (a few years ago, I suppose), AWS APIs were incapable of using IPv6 internally, so a VPC still needed to dual-stack it in order to use AWS cloud features. That may have changed by now.


Yep, lots of AWS apis don't work over ipv6, and many require making requests outside the VPC, so you need to have at least one ipv4 address for a NAT.


You can use NAT64, it works with all the AWS services. Although it's pretty stupid that services like ECR don't have IPv6.


NAT64 requires you to have a NAT with a public ipv4 address. Or possibly pay to use someone elses NAT.


AWS supports NAT64 automatically if you have an Internet gateway attached, you just need to set it up in the VPC settings.


https://docs.aws.amazon.com/vpc/latest/userguide/nat-gateway...

Says you need to have an AWS NAT for that to work. And AFAIK, setting up a NAT requires an ipv4 elastic ip.

And it makes since that AWS would want customers to have their own IP for NAT64, so that if one customer does something to get the ip address blocklisted it doesn't impact other customers.


Yes, you're correct.

Though I don't think AWS cares too much about IP blocklist, you can always just get another elastic IP at any moment.


IPv4 prices peaked during the Covid pandemic, presumably because of sudden high demand. Amazon took this as an opportunity to increase prices.

Now IPv4 prices are returning to pre-Covid long-term trends. But of course Amazon won't reflect that in their pricing table.


> Amazon took this as an opportunity to increase prices.

IPv4 prices peaked in early 2022; AWS started charging for public IPv4 in 2024 (announced in 2023):

* https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/new-aws-public-ipv4-address...

If they had increased prices in 2022 (or at least announced in 2022), then I could see some kind of correlation, but give it was 1.5-2 years after, I doubt there is a connection.


i would expect aws needs a year or two from when they decide to charge for something new just to work out the details


> i would expect aws needs a year or two from when they decide to charge for something new just to work out the details

The price had already dropped, and was continuing to fall, when they announced the change, so if rising acquisition cost was the primary reason for adding the IPv4 charge, it had already went away.

I think AWS has looked at a utilization graph and sees a time their current pool is get used up at current rates and doesn't want to go through the hassle of acquiring more IPv4 addresses, regardless of cost (even if it is "cheap").

I also think that they have statistic for their www.Amazon.com storefront, and maybe are seeing a good proportion from IPv6 and so figure that there's a 'critical mass' (especially mobile).


There is a lot of lag in decisions like this so price falling isn't enough to say anything.


AWS is seeing growth rates reduce and needs to pump up their revenue.

They're moving onto the "squeeze" part of the cycle.


In practice the tech giants such as Google, Apple and Microsoft will dictate adoption of technology. When Chrome starts mandating or heavily recommending IPv6, adoption will reach 99% overnight. That's what happened with https: https://www.znetlive.com/blog/google-chrome-68-mandates-http...


One can only hope.

Either this or a "killer app" use-case that requires IPv6 will push it forward significantly, IMHO.


Like high-quality video calling for free?

Companies will relay your video calls for free. For now. Basically undercutting. The only way to prevent undercutting is by the government regulation.


The market price is only something like 5 or 10 dollars a month, but anyone having to pay that to be accessible is an embarrassing failure of the system. It doesn't matter whether it's a big dent in the number of IPs or not.


There are billions of people out there who can access the internet, and make themselves accessible through the internet the way they want, just fine without a dedicated IP address.

Maybe you have a definition of "access" that is different from the usual one. That's fine, but let's be honest, it's not the usual definition.


Someone being able to connect to their device is the definition I use. What's your definition?

Being able to relay through a third party is a different thing.


Most people are totally fine relaying everything through a third party. A vanishingly small number of email users host it themselves.


But is it "well off people not having a problem paying a buck or two directly or indirectly to an american corporation to be able to bounce traffic" which you refer to as "most people"? I can see how a few billion other people would have problems with that concept for many reasons apart from the obvious financial one.

And for everyone that does pay this "internet tax", it only strengthens the position of said corporations to be able to buy up even more of the available routable ips. It's not hard to see that the end result is very much not in the consumers favor, regardless of how unnecessary it feels for customers currently to have a real ip when all they want is kitten animations on social media.


But this third party isn't free service even if it runs on ip6.


What? I don’t write a check to Google to use their email. It’s free.


This is a problem.


Almost nobody (far, far less than 1% of users overall) do pay this; the system is in this regard smashingly successful by econometric standards.


The IP consolidation is reasonably successful, but it doesn't have to break port forwarding, that's laziness and negligence.


This isn't necessarily true. The scarcity of IPv4 addresses could very well induce a lack of demand and decrease the price. You wouldn't dream of developing a technology that requires people to have an individual IP address, so you don't. This massively reduces the demand for v4 addresses. It's not as if there are users out there who will demand the features you can't implement, and it's not as if you could fund the entire IPv6 network by yourself to bring about those features. Then ISPs have no reason to support v6 because no customers demand it. Instead of increased price, the cost is paid through decreased service. Think of a congested road network. It could be well worth it to build some more roads and ease congestion, but if there is no one in the system willing to pay for it, everyone will suffer.


Doesn't CGNAT also mess up things like Nintendo Switch online multiplayer?


Nintendo should really enable IPv6 on the Switch to help with this


The network experience on Nintendo devices always seemed janky and home-grown. I feel like they built everything from scratch at corp HQ complete with wonky edge cases.


Why was this downvoted? It’s exactly right.

The reason that IPv6 is so lightly used is that it’s cheaper to use IPv4 + workarounds.

I’m not saying this is a good thing or a bad thing, or making any value judgment about IPv4 vs IPv6.

People and businesses don’t spend money on technology upgrades where the benefit is not measurably better than what they already have.

This is just common sense; no one wants to throw away money.

If you want people to use IPv6, then IPv4 has to fail first. As long as people keep making it work then the benefits of changing will never outweigh the costs.

BTW this is exactly the same situation as clean energy vs fossil fuel, etc. In that situation governments are actively putting their thumb on the economic scales in all sorts of ways. Again, I’m not offering a value judgment, just an observation.


> The reason that IPv6 is so lightly used is that it’s cheaper to use IPv4 + workarounds

Cheaper? Hetzner and other hosts give IPv6 addresses out for free and charge extra for IPv4 addresses.


Most people don’t need a public IPv4 address and can live with CGNAT.

For the relatively small number of people who do need public addresses, renting them from a cloud provider or buying blocks at auction are still economically viable, in comparison to the capital costs of upgrading everything that needs upgrading to support IPv6-only.


And if you want PI addresses, they exist for IPv6 only.




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