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a long-time peeve of mine is that people who frequently talk about the value of a 'well rounded (liberal arts) education' almost always have an implicit exclusion of math.

they think it's great to have some basic knowledge in a wide variety of subjects -- history, literature, music, etc. But when it comes to math, they'll just shrug and gleefully say "i'm not really a math person!"



I think this is from the traditional "Trivium" - grammar, logic, rhetoric - which was considered to be a well-rounded education (presumably for scions of wealthy families).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trivium

In contrast, "Quadrivium" - arithmetic, geometry, music, astronomy - was a follow-up.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadrivium

These constituted the "seven arts". But it was perfectly fine just to be educated in the trivia, if math wasn't your cup of tea.

See the "Yes Minister" clip where Sir Humphrey vehemently denies being so low-standard as to be educated in the sciences - he was good enough to study the classics.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ckgt4VWIsf4

(edited for better grammar, logic and rhetoric.)


> But when it comes to math, they'll just shrug and gleefully say "i'm not really a math person!"

I’m always shocked that people aren’t embarrassed to say that in public.


Relevant quote:

"Anyone who cannot cope with mathematics is not fully human. At best, he is a tolerable subhuman who has learned to wear his shoes, bathe, and not make messes in the house." -Robert Heinlein


This quote is harsh enough that I feel the need to say that this is one of Heinlein's characters talking.

Although the whole "innumerates are terrible" thing appears all over his books.


Agreed. It is harsh.


Why should they be embarrassed? It is the inability of Math teachers to instruct those who have difficulty with Mathematics.

Aren’t K12 schools teaching “new math” or whatever fad, to students and focusing on teaching to a test due to no child left behind?

I wonder what studies have been done to measure how many students are math deficient in general population.

Furthermore, what are approaches that could remediate such issues?


Indeed. People are embarrassed to admit that they're illiterate, but somehow it's different when it comes to math.


I also found this strange since a Liberal Arts education should really have Logic - which was an integral part of Philosophy - the oldest of the liberal arts


What is the expected level of math for a well-rounded liberal arts education? I am okay at best at any type of advanced math. I'm also okay at best in most of the other advanced areas of my liberal arts education that I didn't major/minor in.


I hope they have a change of mind for some maths up to precalc but honestly teaching Calculus to liberal arts majors is torture and pointless.


Math is un-democratic.


Pretty sure this is the stupidest thing I've ever read.

Edit: OP deleted it now, and I wish I saved it, but he originally posted a long spiel on how math is undemocratic because anyone can prove anyone else wrong.


Never try to disagree with the 2+2=22 crowd (short film Alternative Math (2017): https://www.boredteachers.com/post/short-film-shows-sad-real...




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