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Then they should be taught, quick. Once is grounds for an apology, twice is bye-bye land. Who cares about 'objective' toxicity, WTF is wrong with people defending yelling at people.



> people defending yelling at people.

The probability is unusually high that they personally yell at people in collaborative meetings.


Trying not to make assumptions about people here, but yes, probably.

Many have been taught by abusive parents or figures of authority, or whatever shit television, that it's normal. "Some 'light' yelling is to be expected.", "Different styles of management/debate", "whatever works for them, I'm sure everyone does it a bit". What next? Corporal punishment? Like in the old days, when kids really respected their elders - or else - and were taught /right/ and women stayed in their place?

Those people need to be taught that no one, ever, should have yelled or should ever yell at them for being wrong or just disagreeing. It's not OK, it never was, it never is. Parents, friends, teachers, colleagues.

You spend 8 hours a day at work, if it's not a safe place, and you can find another job, GTF away as fast as possible, or have the perpetrators get the hell away, if you have this power.

I'm sorry we even have to say that.


If you're defending people yelling at people, you probably won't be pointing out that they are misguided if they think yelling is acceptable.

However, the claim being made was that this yelling was a trap that was intentionally set to drive Chris out and not just a case of someone who thinks yelling is acceptable behavior.


I was trying to answer to that (frankly paranoid rant about traps being set) by simplifying: Repeatedly yelling = fired. He or no one should driven away by violent behaviour. Fire the misbehaving person or say (like an adult): hey Chris, we (your management) are in disagreement with whatever, and are going with someone else as leadership, so we're reassigning you. If you want to go, well here's the door.

Anything else is just accepting sociopathic mind games. 'oh he shouldn't have felt threatened by violence and unchecked unacceptable behaviour! he was so naive, toxicity is not objective, suck it up'. WTF. I'm all for hearing the other side of this story but please, everyone (not you, GeekyBear!) stop defending sociopaths (or violent people) being sociopaths, and blaming victims not being sociopaths themselves.

The late Pieter Hintjens' writings on psychopathic behaviour needs a re-reading...




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