> Those police were doing crowd control. If they were not deployed there would have been no on-duty injuries.

"The Bank security guard would have never been hurt if they just let people steal the money and take hostages."

> Maybe you don’t know that the police officer who died, died as a result of a blood clot.

This is beyond bad faith, this is insulting. And i'm not going to participate anymore. I just hope people like you die out before this country is irrevocably harmed, and your children don't carry your sickness to a new generation.

> "The Bank security guard would have never been hurt if they just let people steal the money and take hostages."

can you explain this analogy? What are you assuming the protestors would have done if the police weren’t deployed?

> I just hope people like you die out before this country is irrevocably harmed, and your children don't carry your sickness to a new generation.

This is a pretty radical statement. I’m actually a center left liberal and you’re wishing that I die simply because of a fact I brought up that refutes your narrative. Can you substantiate your claims that I’m causing harm to this country by citing facts? How did you get this radicalized?

I regret spending even a moment interacting with you.

Well I don’t know what to tell you. I’ve been cordial and rational in my reasoning and interactions with you. Why does the mention of the fact that the officer’s cause of death was a blood clot provoke such a strong negative reaction?

Please.

You're pretending that your "rational" arguments are anything other than bad faith.

It's difficult to take anything you say seriously when you can't admit that the actions this week are not the same as the women's march.

This is game that the rest of us are tired of being subjected to. The results of this style of thinking has just borne fruit thanks to the continued lying and obfuscating of the President and his gaggle of sycophants. The world is not confused about the dangerous actions that just transpired.

You are purposefully and willingly beyond reach.

The fact remains that 4 unarmed protestors were killed, at least 2 were directly killed by capitol police. There were no deaths directly caused by the protestors. Sicknick died from a blood clot.

So when you say that the protestors caused a truly harmful action to take place, what exactly are you referring to?

...breaking and entering into congress?

Yea again, by that logic, it was also a truly harmful action when the women’s March protestors stormed the capitol. https://twitter.com/EgSophie/status/1048634940169048064?s=20

Of course, if you’re fair and reasonable in your judgments you’d see that both were legitimate protests, and the only innocent victims of violence in the maga protest were the unarmed protestors themselves.

It's MAGA world, they are closing ranks around "violence is ok look what you made us do".

It's the natural last step in any fascist movement. The question remains, how many Americans remain this radicalized. If the number is low enough , the country survives.

Btw even Matt Gaetz can’t defend that one, which is why you see him hallucinating under command on national television about them being antifa.

Matt Gaetz is not an authority on what is true and his take on things is irrelevant in this thread.

Clearly not. But it’s a clear example of where the rest of this society is drawing the line.

That argument is as valid as the argument that I should jump off a cliff because the rest of society is doing it.

That argument is as valid as arguing that jumping off cliffs for no reason and admitting that breaking into congress is bad are equivalent.

I never compared jumping off cliffs and breaking into Congress. The point is that your argument that we ought to condemn the actions of the trump supporters because the rest of society has done so is not a rational argument.

I don’t think breaking into Congress is always bad. I support people’s right to peaceful protest. The Trump supporters by and large did not initiate violence, the violence was initiated on them by the police. If there was evidence that the trump supporters actually were initiating mass violence against people in the capitol that would be a different story, but with 4 unarmed protestors dead, they were the only ones who suffered casualties. That’s simply a fact.

You’re drawing a line that any protest which occupies the capitol is immoral. I disagree with that but if you really believe that, was it immoral when the women’s March protesters took the capitol? https://twitter.com/EgSophie/status/1048634940169048064?s=20

> your argument that we ought to condemn the actions of the trump supporters because the rest of society has done so is not a rational argument.

I’m not arguing that at all, I’m just telling you what the rest of the society is doing; that pressure you feel to change your opinion is coming entirely from within yourself.

> was it immoral when the women’s March protesters took the capitol?

I’m not sure, let me check: did they break windows and doors to gain entry into the capitol building? Did they break into representatives’ offices? Were there weapons and detaining tools found on their persons?

> I’m not sure, let me check: did they break windows and doors to gain entry into the capitol building? Did they break into representatives’ offices? Were there weapons and detaining tools found on their persons?

So now your position is that it’s okay to occupy a capitol building as long as you don’t break windows, break into representatives offices, and/or some small percentage of them have weapons on them? Even if they directly cause no one harm. Okay. Was it immoral when BLM occupied and damaged the Ohio capitol? https://www.cleveland.com/open/2020/05/state-officials-asses...

> Damage included 28 broken windows along the west and south sides of the building, as well as damage to the wooden window frames, five pole lamps and two doors, including the West Rotunda entrance, according to the Capitol Square Review and Advisory Board, the agency responsible for keeping the Statehouse grounds. Flags planted in flower beds were burned.

> So now your position is that it’s okay to occupy a capitol building as long as you don’t break windows, break into representatives offices, and/or some small percentage of them have weapons on them?

No, but it’s the bare essentials to stick to if you don’t want to be taken for an insurrectionist.

> Was it immoral when BLM occupied and damaged the Ohio capitol?

Yes! Whoever thought that was a good idea is a goddamn punk. Although, they weren’t trying to change the outcome of an election; that’s a pretty significant difference. There’s few things in a democracy worse than interfering with its election, I’m sure you agree, except maybe literally blowing it up.

> I never compared jumping off cliffs and breaking into Congress.

You’re not a child, I think, so I can’t scare you with made up stories about what happens when you lie. But seriously, it’s not good for you, or those around you.

I applaud your efforts pqhwan.

But this is the point I tried to make at the top of this thread.

These people are playing a game. They aren't interested in talking about this honestly.

Seriously, where is the legitimate debate about the events of this week?

Is anyone compelled by the idea that this seditious event was comparable to the women's march?

I don't know what tools we have to bring these people back. I wish I could point to something and say "here", this is how we can find common ground. But they are proving every day that they are more interested in this dishonest babble than engaging in serious discussion.

Again, for anyone whose made it this far. The fact that they are pretending that there is no difference between the women's march and the events this week are all you need to see to dismiss the rest of the justifications they put forth.

Don't fall for the trap. They wont argue "the point". They will deflect, lie and twist every issue to fit their narrative.

And...

"While authorities haven’t provided details on the medical emergencies, Greeson’s son said his father died from a heart attack mid-protest. Boyland died after being crushed by the crowd, according to one report, while Philips had a stroke, fellow protesters said."

https://www.thedailybeast.com/benjamin-philips-kevin-greeson...

If they do respond, it will be with "Yeah but what about..." without missing a beat. No reflection, no introspection, just furthering the infinite game.

More footage: https://twitter.com/mickeydelo/status/1348312979129905155