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It is difficult for foreigners to start companies in the EU, even modulo the fact that it's somewhat difficult for residents to start companies in parts of the EU.

I don't know anything about Asian immigration, but I know a very little bit about EU policies, and I don't think they're a competitive threat to us here.




Huh? This sounds totally wrong to me.

The UK and Germany, the two strongest EU startup countries, both already have founders visas and there's nothing special about a foreigner owning shares in a Ltd or GmbH, the respective equivalents of a US incorporation.

Also, in my experience, founding a UK Ltd is even easier than doing a US Inc if for no other reason than that you don't have to deal with both federal and state institutions as in the US. The stuff that the Companies House sends you is super straight-forward (impressively so, other countries should take note), and can be done mostly online. Germany is (surprise!) more bureaucratic and things take a bit longer, but it's still not rocket surgery.

On the whole immigration and getting permanent residence is much easier in both countries. The UK has a point system for highly skilled immigrants, and you can get permanent residence in both in 5 years without having had to stick around at a single employer.


I have several degreed acquaintances who were ejected from the UK and EU. I'm married to someone who immigrated to Switzerland for work. The impression from people I know is that it's not particularly easy to move to Europe from the US.

I'm not sure what you mean by state / fed institutions, unless you mean that you have to pay both state and federal income tax (... but so does everyone, whether or not they own a company). When we set up Matasano, the only thing I remember us having to do with fedgov was getting an EIN.


Incorporation in the US is done on a state level, not by the federal government; he was comparing incorporating in the US to the Ltd model in the UK.


Switzerland has a very restrictive immigration policy compared to other European countries.


Erin wasn't ejected from Switzerland; the most recent ejection instance happened to an acquaintance living in London.


The UK and Germany, the two strongest EU startup countries, both already have founders visas

Please tell us more. That's one of the reasons I asked the question I did up above, to find out more about what other countries are doing as a guide to what policy would be beneficial for the United States.

I did some Google searching, and one person who was responding to HN discussion of this issue on a blog mentioned the United Kingdom highly skilled worker visa,

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/workingintheuk/tier1/gener...

and from that page I found out about the United Kingdom entrepreneur visa

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/workingintheuk/tier1/entre...

and the United Kingdom investor visa.

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/workingintheuk/tier1/inves...

But, what, exactly, is a United Kingdom founder visa?

I found a German government website about visas and browsed around, but what exactly is a German founder visa?

Please tell us more. I'd be delighted to hear from HNers who have actually made use of something just like the proposed founder visa for the United States to immigrate to some other country, if we have such people here.


The entrepreneur visa was the one that I was referring to in the UK, which has similar requirements (actually lower – access to £200k in capital) as the proposed US founder's visa.

The German setup is similar, requiring the creation of at least 5 jobs and €250k in capital (though exceptions can be made, and I know some who have gotten them):

http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http://www.gtai.com/...

I personally came over on the equivalent of an H1B, which was, compared to the US, incredibly easy to obtain. Basically I had a job offer, which I'd found while in Germany on a tourist visa in Germany, and took the letter from my employer along with a couple other filled out forms up to the Foreigner's Office (Ausländeramt), and was issued a two-year visa on the spot. I'll just emphasize that again: I was granted an H1B equivalent on the same day that I applied for it. There's a bit of a song and dance of them saying that they couldn't find an EU person for the job, but that's mostly a formality that's just a matter of the person writing the employment letter knowing how to write it. After 5 years I was eligible for permanent residence, and didn't start a company until after that. Though I had two different jobs in that time, which would have reset the counter for me in the US.

This isn't to say that people don't ever get kicked out or fail to get visas – I don't think there's a country in the world where it's a joy to deal with immigration officials, but certainly comparing my own experience to folks that I've known that have done equivalent things in the US makes what I've gone through seem like a walk in the park.




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