It's not about the minimum wage it's about what's considered poverty. If you make below $41866/year here you are living in poverty.
> heavy and intrusive labor regulations
I'm curious as to what you consider heavy and intrusive labour regulations? All of the regulations in the industry I work in are focused on worker health and safety. Without those regulations I would be working in dangerous hell hole breathing in toxic dust constantly, where I wouldn't be paid overtime wages, be legally eligible for breaks and my shifts could be whatever the fuck my boss wanted.
>but that's not the point. It's a supplement to your existing income.
Several other posts in this comment thread alone seem to disagree and believe it's a reasonable amount of money to live on.
>will provide minimum means not to fall into abject poverty
>actually do see it as solely sustainable, in the scenario I outlined.
There's also comments on here from people talking about how it will give them time for this that or the other.
Lets see, for me at least I would need to get $1200 every month just to cover rent and i've lived in the same place for 8 years now. Rent in that time has doubled around me to the point where a one bedroom apartment is $2400/month. My internet bill is just under $100/ month, phone bill is about half that, travelling to and from work is about $200 a month, groceries and expenses and such another $200 or so if not more. Leaving whatever I have left for saving and fun.
I'm just really trying to imagine what kind ubi could be given to anyone that would really make a difference.
I understand why people want this and I understand the wanting to believe people will take this money and be alright and use the extra time they will suddenly have to better their skills still feel ok when low skilled work becomes unavailable.
The reality will be something more along the lines of an underclass living in ghettos being unable to move up. As it is even the most unskilled work around requires expensive tickets and certifications. Hell apparently even burlesque dancers here can't get work without a ticket saying they went to burlesque school.
This is going to keep happening and the barrier of entry to things will keep being raised to the point where these people won't be able to enter the workforce even if they tried. Even i'm not doing what I went to school for because I can't afford the $15,000/year fee to register as a professional. So despite my education,degrees and my work experience, I don't get hired because I can't pay to have that little R.P. appended to my name.
Having extra time and a little bit of extra money means nothing when the fees for entry are beyond what you can put together without already working.
And i'm not even going to bother going on about the reality of what happens when you give poor unmotivated people free money...but maybe look into council estates and what happens there in the UK.
> Lets see, for me at least I would need to get $1200 every month just to cover rent and i've lived in the same place for 8 years now. Rent in that time has doubled around me to the point where a one bedroom apartment is $2400/month. My internet bill is just under $100/ month, phone bill is about half that, travelling to and from work is about $200 a month, groceries and expenses and such another $200 or so if not more. Leaving whatever I have left for saving and fun. I'm just really trying to imagine what kind ubi could be given to anyone that would really make a difference.
So, part of the problem here is that UBI means different things to different people. When I wrote the comment that started this thread, I was talking very specifically about UBI as a way to offset advancements in automation, if and only if those advances reach a point where we don't have enough work left for humans to do. This may very well never happen, but it also might!
In a world like this one, most of the stuff you buy would have very little human involvement. You say your groceries cost ~$200 per month right now; imagine if those groceries were planted by robots and harvested by robots and shipped to stores in self-driving cars. Those robots don't need to get paid (even if they cost some money to run), so the food they produce would be much cheaper!
The same mechanism that makes UBI necessary is also what makes UBI feasible.
Now if you live in a city, your rent probably wouldn't go down, because it's driven by scarcity much more so than production costs. Robots can't magically add extra space inside of a city. So I suspect most of the people living in wealthy cities would still need jobs, and the people who opt to live on UBI alone would move to cheaper locations. That could be worth the trade off if it means more time to persue hobbies or raise children, etc.
> heavy and intrusive labor regulations
I'm curious as to what you consider heavy and intrusive labour regulations? All of the regulations in the industry I work in are focused on worker health and safety. Without those regulations I would be working in dangerous hell hole breathing in toxic dust constantly, where I wouldn't be paid overtime wages, be legally eligible for breaks and my shifts could be whatever the fuck my boss wanted.
>but that's not the point. It's a supplement to your existing income.
Several other posts in this comment thread alone seem to disagree and believe it's a reasonable amount of money to live on.
>will provide minimum means not to fall into abject poverty
>actually do see it as solely sustainable, in the scenario I outlined.
There's also comments on here from people talking about how it will give them time for this that or the other.
Lets see, for me at least I would need to get $1200 every month just to cover rent and i've lived in the same place for 8 years now. Rent in that time has doubled around me to the point where a one bedroom apartment is $2400/month. My internet bill is just under $100/ month, phone bill is about half that, travelling to and from work is about $200 a month, groceries and expenses and such another $200 or so if not more. Leaving whatever I have left for saving and fun.
I'm just really trying to imagine what kind ubi could be given to anyone that would really make a difference.
I understand why people want this and I understand the wanting to believe people will take this money and be alright and use the extra time they will suddenly have to better their skills still feel ok when low skilled work becomes unavailable.
The reality will be something more along the lines of an underclass living in ghettos being unable to move up. As it is even the most unskilled work around requires expensive tickets and certifications. Hell apparently even burlesque dancers here can't get work without a ticket saying they went to burlesque school.
This is going to keep happening and the barrier of entry to things will keep being raised to the point where these people won't be able to enter the workforce even if they tried. Even i'm not doing what I went to school for because I can't afford the $15,000/year fee to register as a professional. So despite my education,degrees and my work experience, I don't get hired because I can't pay to have that little R.P. appended to my name.
Having extra time and a little bit of extra money means nothing when the fees for entry are beyond what you can put together without already working.
And i'm not even going to bother going on about the reality of what happens when you give poor unmotivated people free money...but maybe look into council estates and what happens there in the UK.