Hacker Newsnew | past | comments | ask | show | jobs | submitlogin

Not quite so clear. This is a layoff of 14,000 hardware or low-level networking systems engineers [1], not 14,000 front-end developers, it is not so obvious to me that the current Silicon Valley market is ready to absorb them so easily.

Interesting to think those were the kind of jobs, and CISCO the kind of company, that once gave Silicon Valley its name. Makes you wonder how the market for software engineers, even adaptable always-learning hack-through-the-night-for-fun engineers, might look in 20 or 30 years.

[1] Read "(low-level networking systems) engineers", not "low-level (networking systems engineers )"



I agree but they have a guaranteed job if they retrain. These are relatively smart and educated people. Retraining shouldn't be the end of the world.

In my profession (banking), staff levels have been going pretty much consistently down since the financial crisis, as banks shrink or retreat from certain activities. But these are mostly bright, educated, business savvy people, who end up doing something else. For many it is a blessing in disguise, an opportunity (albeit in a brutal way) to move away from a shrinking industry to become their own boss or to work on the next big thing.


True, but most companies are going to look at them as no better than recent grads if they need to retrain.

Imagine what a guy makes that's been at Cisco for 15 years? Now imagine what you can pay a recent graduate or H1B.


They can retrain as big data specialists! No long term experts out there. A graduate with 1y experience is a veteran.


It's not 14,000 engineers who are getting laid off. It is across all functions.


I always wonder what happens to those software engineers, the "hack through the night" sort of guys. They must eventually burn out, or get replaced by the younger developers who are onto the next "hack through the night" project.

There must reach a stage in development where you're considered "too old" (sadly) or haven't kept up with the latest and greatest in trends.

What do you do then?? Project manage? Do all developers move into project management?

I see this mildly where I work where older developers are greatly valued (they're good!) but haven't kept up to date, eg. a lot of C++ is here, but nobody here (and I mean nobody) has any understanding of C++11, C++14 changes and are stuck in the C++98 ways. They even call C++11 "C++0x" still. This is different to the "learn the next fad" approach, as C++98/2003 deserve to go away.


I work with a guy like this. His knowledge base is vast (we're electrical engineers and he's a master of both hardware and software). He's also a shambling zombie from a lifetime of hacking through the night. I'm not exaggerating. He mostly just shuffles through his days, trying to get anything done, but he's just too fried. He rarely sleeps. I've never seen him eat. He won't take vacation days. He seems to have decided a long time ago to just drive himself insane. Honestly, I think if he weren't one of the guys the company can't afford to lose because he knows things about our products no one else in the building does, they'd probably let him go.


There is a difference between not knowing the latest and greatest, and not keeping yourself updated with the evolution of your tool of choice. Most people will do the former after a while. It's too much time spend with too little gain. The latter however is not acceptable. I want my developers to know about the latest version of .net, and if they're not using linq they're doing it wrong.


But if they are not using WCF they are doing it right! Not all evolutions of the tool should be followed blindly.


Indeed. Pioneers are the people with arrows in their backs. For a stable system it's reasonable to wait before adopting change; especially if large areas of the existing system are built with a previous technology. Moving to new changes results in internal inconsistency, and possibly problems at the boundaries.


I never stated all evolution should be followed blindly. But once the evolution becomes established as best practice, there is very few reasons to not do it.


But 8y ago WCF was marketed by Microsoft as the future of web services. It was clear to me from the outset that it was a mightmare to configure and unecessary complex. Now I think it is the generally accepted view. But if we have to wait 8 years for each new technology...


8 years for each new technology indeed....

MFC anyone?

With the push to Universal Apps (that nobody appears to be heeding), what is Microsoft's recommended toolkit for C++ in Windows now eh?

Here we are with > 2 million lines of C++, entirely MFC and COM.


This is a personality thing I think. Some people do want to just stick with what they know by the time they are 25 and would rather be unemployed or in management than learn something new. I'm 45. I've worked in video games for my entire working life. Yet throughout that time I've shifted roles drastically every 5-10 years. This keeps things fresh and it lets me stay employed and in demand without having to become a hands-off manager or sit in the corner working on legacy code.


>> There must reach a stage in development where you're considered "too old" (sadly) or haven't kept up with the latest and greatest in trends.

Just imagine how much knowledge and experience these guys have and is effectively being lost by them being out of the workforce.




Guidelines | FAQ | Lists | API | Security | Legal | Apply to YC | Contact

Search: